• DannyBoy@sh.itjust.works
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    2 months ago

    What would it look like? I’d guess Amazon ads in the search bar, proprietary package managers overriding the old open package manager, and popup ads for distribution Pro?

    Wait…

    • barbara@lemmy.ml
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      2 months ago

      Ubuntu was my first distro because ubuntu was linux for outsiders many years ago. Any other distro was only for hardcore people. I don’t regret hopping around the linux world.

      • jkrtn@lemmy.ml
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        2 months ago

        I also started on Ubuntu. They used to be pretty great, good device support and basically no hassle. But I am done af and not going back.

        • DannyBoy@sh.itjust.works
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          2 months ago

          That’s me as well, they did a lot to get newcomers in. It’s just easy to poke fun at them these days.

          • AbidanYre@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            It was the only one that didn’t freeze when I plugged something into the USB port on my laptop when I started 20 years ago.

            I’ve since moved to plain Debian because of canonical’s decisions.

        • 𝕾𝖕𝖎𝖈𝖞 𝕿𝖚𝖓𝖆@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          I used Ubuntu for over 10 years. I loved it. But Canonical does have a lot of baggage. Plus, I wanted to go to the source. So that’s why I use Debian. I’d still advise a new user to go for Mint if they loved the Windows UI or Ubuntu if they hated it. If you use and love Mint, I don’t think anyone would criticize you for continuing to use it. If you use and love Ubuntu, I’d say Debian is a very easy next step.

          • phx@lemmy.ca
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            2 months ago

            I used to be “Debian on the server, Ubuntu on the desktop” but recently I’ve spun up a few Debian boxes for desktop and I’m pleasantly surprised.

            Kinda wish Valve would go for a full-out supported distro that stays in step with the Deck for Linux gamers (the old desktop SteamOS is kinda abandoned from what I can see), among with making the deck frontend a supported desktop manager. It would make sense for them to do so and rake in the game sales whilst providing a well-supported platform without the shit others are doing.

            • zaphodb2002@sh.itjust.works
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              2 months ago

              Check out Bazzite, it’s basically that. I’ve been using it on my desktop for gaming and development for a month or so now and it’s been great.

              • phx@lemmy.ca
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                2 months ago

                Thanks. I’ll check into it but TBH I do really prefer .DEB based distros and that one seems to be Fedora based

          • Elkenders@feddit.uk
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            2 months ago

            Yeah I’ve got Debian on the server and on my laptop and I don’t know why I’d want anything more user experience focussed. It just works for me.

      • CalcProgrammer1@lemmy.ml
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        2 months ago

        Same. I started really using Linux with Ubuntu 6.06 and was drawn in by its “Linux for human beings” goals - the Ubuntu homepage of the era really pushed the ideals of community and openness. Canonical sat in the background paying to send you free CDs in the mail. It was such an idealistic thing back then.

        And then it all changed around 2010. The color scheme shifted to a shitty MacOS lookalike, the human elements were dropped, the logo was reworked, it got bundled with a paid music store, then Amazon ads in the search, and it’s been a roller coaster on a downward spiral ever since. I switched to Debian not long after the initial enshittification in the early 2010s and have not looked back, though I moved most of my systems to Arch a few years back because I like life in the fast rolling release lane and Debian wouldn’t support my new GPUs.

        • warmaster@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          Hey! Sorry for the offtopic comment but… Glad you made it to Lemmy, and from the bottom of my heart: thank you so much for OpenRGB.

          Awesome collab with KDE, Tuxedo, looking forward to the kernel implementation !

          • phx@lemmy.ca
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            2 months ago

            Huh? Is the previous poster an OpenRGB developer? That’s cool!

            • warmaster@lemmy.world
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              2 months ago

              He’s the lead dev, his profile pic is the OpenRGB logo and his nickname is the same across social networks.

      • bigmclargehuge@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        I got into linux right before all the snap drama really blew up (it did exist but didn’t seem to be quite as hot of a topic). I really liked my experience with Ubuntu, but seeing where Canonical has taken it, I’d never recommend it to anyone. I’d honestly advise newbies to use Debian. It’s incredibly stable, has a fantastic and well established community, and has everything an average user would want without adding layers of confusion with things like snap.

    • phx@lemmy.ca
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      2 months ago

      Increasingly so, and following the path that RedHat was taking prior (and probably worse to come given their new ownership)

        • TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          RedHat is one of, if not the, biggest contributors to Linux. They offer RHEL, which you license as a business or use for free for personal use.

          RedHat became pissed off about contributing so much to the Linux ecosystem when a number of other corporate distros simply took their product, changed the name, then shoved it out the door with a price tag that undercuts them, taking money while contributing virtually nothing to the wider ecosystem.

          And to be clear I don’t mean distros based on RHEL, like Pop/Elementary/Mint is to Ubuntu, I mean literally clones. The exact same software with zero differences other than name.

          RH then changed their subscription terms so that redistribution of their source code means they can drop you as a RHEL customer. I.e. you wouldn’t have access to further to source code.

          This is widely believed to be compatible with the GPL licence that Linux uses — GPL only guarantees users need to be able to see source code, not necessarily that it has to be completely open for anybody to see. GPL also doesn’t compel the developer to provide updates for everyone, so if the developer thinks you’ve broken other terms they’ve set, they are allowed to drop you/not deal with you further. GPL doesn’t force a developer to have you as their continued customer.

          People argue that RH may well be complying with the GPL legally, but they aren’t in spirit.

          I’m still not sure where I come down on it tbh. Philosophically I want RH to go with the spirit of the GPL, but I do find it really shitty that a number of other projects just straight up take RH’s product, put a different name on it, and skim money away from an organisation that has transformed the Linux desktop and made it usable.

          Thing is, I don’t even think it’s worked. They can still get all the packages by pulling it in a slightly cumbersome way from CentOS.

          • phx@lemmy.ca
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            2 months ago

            That’s actually not what I was referring to.

            First of all, RedHat now belongs to IBM, and they’ve never been shy about squeezing customers for a buck.

            Second, having dealt with their support, it’s hit or miss to get a somebody helpful or an endless cycle of tickets. Patching and versioning is sometimes a complete mess.This especially sucks as the main reason most organizations go with RH versus others is for patching and support.

            There’s also a lot of things where there’s a RH-specific implementation , which is further distancing fun other Linuxes and often ignores standard ways of configuring things.

            RedHat actually benefitted from Fedora, CentOS etc as it allowed the community to develop products in a way that could be tested to be reasonably compatible, and to develop our port back fixes etc. It wasn’t just “RedHat made this and others just took it” but in many ways a symbiotic relationship. Yeah some orgs just went with CentOS but often it was those who worked on RH corporately would run CentOS at home in order to have a similar environment.

            • TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world
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              2 months ago

              I know they’re owned by IBM now. Doesn’t change anything about my comment.

              And yeah there was a symbiotic relationship. There still is. Fedora is still quite alike RHEL in many ways, as is CentOS, as are the RHEL clones.

              None of this goes against my comment.

          • TMP_NKcYUEoM7kXg4qYe@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            I think what they tried to achieve was to get rid of the “bit to bit” copypasted distributions which they at least made harder to make. So I suppose at least the cost to “steal the RHEL source” is higher.

            btw I dislike that Free Software is also free (0.00 €) software. I feel like there should be some kind of chimera license which would first be proprietary with source available and after a certain time after purchase the code would be open source for the buyer. So you could actually sell it unlike Open Source Software which you can sell only once because the first person can just start giving away free copies. Sadly people in the open source realm tend to get pretty defensive when they see “proprietary”. Would cool if flathub at least implemented some kind of way to sell software even if Open Source, that would be a nice start.

        • gnuplusmatt@reddthat.com
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          2 months ago

          Nothing, someone who never needed access to the RHEL snapshot source is butt hurt that it only exists as part of centOS stream, making it harder for community rebuilds to exist.

          It’s no big deal for 95% of users, truly a nonissue. That last 5% can buy RHEL for production or use it for free for personal hosting or development.

      • umbrella@lemmy.ml
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        2 months ago

        honestly canocical was doing some enshittification type stuff even before redhat was acquired by the corporate overlords.

      • Scrath@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        2 months ago

        Oh definitely.

        I still hate my old phone for locking ADB behind a Mi account registration and when I wanted to go into the theme settings some stupid marketplace app opened from which I could quit by hitting the back button to het to the actual android theme settings

        • aluminium@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          yeah, also the constant wait times when you install APK… it used to be a decent OS but starting with MiUi 11 they started really enshitifiying big time.

          • Fisch@discuss.tchncs.de
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            2 months ago

            And now they changed the name to HyperOS (my dad has a phone with it installed and is constantly complaining about it)

        • umbrella@lemmy.ml
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          2 months ago

          sounds like a perfect opportunity to use this account to unlock the bootloader and swap out the os for something not enshittified

          • Scrath@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            2 months ago

            I thought about doing that but if I remember correctly they wanted some information during account creation that I was not willing to share (it was probably my phone number).

            Doesn’t matter anymore. My new phone is a pixel 7 on which I immediately installed GrapheneOS

  • darkpanda@lemmy.ca
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    2 months ago

    Exit codes from processes are damage points that you take against your HP. When your HP runs out, the distro reformats itself to a clean state.

    • Takios@discuss.tchncs.de
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      2 months ago

      Instead of reformatting it just logs you out and demands buying a Heal Crystal for 350 Linux Diamonds. You can buy Linux Diamonds in packages of 400 for just 9.99 or buy the 800 package to get a 10% discount!

  • Corgana@startrek.website
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    2 months ago

    I know this is a joke but “Enshittification” requires there to be a monopoly that abuses commercial customers along with users. Linux distros can’t really have monopolies since the switching costs are so low.

    • ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org
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      2 months ago

      Except if you are locked out of system management and you just can’t switch. Or only at the price of hardware incompatibilities and consumer apps refusing to work when they see you after practicing your ownership of the device.
      See Android.

    • Caboose12000@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      The video actually addresses that by mentioning a company coming in nice at first and then doing EEE to kill off ll competition and leave them the only significant player in the space

    • umbrella@lemmy.ml
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      2 months ago

      it can happen if you have some form vendor lockin, or if you are an oligarch in a cartel. it doesnt need a monopoly strictly speaking.

    • Auzy@beehaw.org
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      2 months ago

      Not really. On Lemmy, it seems to just refer to anything these days

      And that includes theoretical predictions for things that never happened yet

      • Sabata11792@kbin.social
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        2 months ago

        I’m ok with dropping a few bucks if I like them, but monthly is just more bills to worry about. Dropping $20 once is a lot easier than drip feeding it over a year and hoping I remember to manage it. It also comes with the expectations of delivery/trade vs buying the dude lunch.

    • umbrella@lemmy.ml
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      2 months ago

      i would have been fine with them if it was only actual announcements like canonical implied it would be. but well as it turns out it wasn’t.

  • Resol van Lemmy@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    Made by Microsoft

    Yes, that does exist, and no, it’s not for consumers, but if it did, it would look and feel like an enshittified Linux distro.

    • shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      2 months ago

      Gnome isn’t bad, at all. The team has caused controversy and made mistakes, but gnome’s experience is great.

      Talking about ubuntu, snaps suck, and it is more “bloated” than what you’d expect, but still, ubuntu isn’t half bad. Is mint better for what the ubuntu audience wants? Yes. Does ubuntu still work well? Yes

      And ubuntu server rocks

    • umbrella@lemmy.ml
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      2 months ago

      even with all its faults and shitty maintainers, gnome is among the best ux of any de.

      • danielfgom@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        To quote Clem, head of Linux Mint: “At a time where GNOME applications are less and less designed to work anywhere else than in GNOME, a project like XApp is extremely important.”

        Libaidwata breaks backward compatibility with older gnome versions and amongst other things doesn’t allow theming natively, so the Cinnamon team are going to have to fork off and maintain the older code which works so they can continue to have theming and stuff with Gnome apps.

        Gnome seem to like doing the opposite of the Linux philosophy which says interoperability should always be a priority so that the code can be shared as freely as possible.

        I can’t tell whether they are stupid or lazy over at Gnome. It’s not enough to strip the DE down to nothing but now even the code that worked with previous, gnome still widely used, is being dumped.

        They are a little island unto themselves.

        • TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          That’s a whole lot of waffle without saying anything of substance.

          “Gnome apps are designed primarily to fit into Gnome 😡😡😡” is not what enshitification means.

          • danielfgom@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            Purposely breaking backwards compatibility knowing full well that other FLOSS DE’s rely on it is enshitification of the worst kind.

            We all lose in the end.

            • TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world
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              2 months ago

              Not 👏 what 👏 enshitification 👏 means 👏

              Gnome can theme their own apps however they like. It’s their project.

    • TheAnonymouseJoker@lemmy.ml
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      2 months ago

      Another Snap/systemd hater idiot spotted. Bet you compile every single package with musl on Gentoo on your Libreboot toaster.

      • umbrella@lemmy.ml
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        2 months ago

        snaps (and the way canonical is pushing them) are awful at best. snaps are the one reason ive been meaning to hop right now, but its not the first time canonical pulls shit like this.

        • TheAnonymouseJoker@lemmy.ml
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          2 months ago

          Snaps can sandbox system applications, with no competitor capable in sight. So what is this shit Canonical is pulling?

          • milicent_bystandr@lemm.ee
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            2 months ago

            a) having apt packages link a script that downloads the snap. That’s the first problem I had, back when I used Ubuntu as as snaps were rolling out. It gave me big trouble updating on bad internet connection.

            b) making the server fixed and proprietary, restricting the freedom to do things differently and offer different changes to other users, that we’re used to in the Linux and FOSS world

          • umbrella@lemmy.ml
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            2 months ago

            in addition to what the guy said:

            how it doesnt respect standards like XDG, and how painfully slow it is.

              • umbrella@lemmy.ml
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                2 months ago

                not at all. speaking as someone who replaced snaps for flatpaks because this specific issue was bothering me a lot.

                • TheAnonymouseJoker@lemmy.ml
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                  2 months ago

                  I was using Snaps until last year just to know how they are doing. Snaps did not feel much slower. However, I felt like I became mature enough to use Debian, so jumped ship.