No, because it happened before I was born. Do you not understand what a self own it is that you have to go back four decades for an example of Chinese police killing the amount of people that the US police kill every four months?
I don’t see why we have to contrast the US and China so that one is a good guy and one is a bad guy. Has the US exploited the rest of the world since WWII for our own financial interests? Yes. Do we have an increasingly authoritarian government seeking to eventually crush internal dissent? Yes.
None of that makes China good.
If you don’t want to talk about Tiananmen Square, talk about China forcefully relocated migrant workers ahead of the Olympics in 2008. Talk about China sending Uyghurs to reeducation camps and forcefully sterilizing some of them. Talk about how China forced women to abandon/ abort babies for 30 years throughout vast swaths of their country. Talk about how people residing in China can’t actually talk about any of these things, to the point where citizens of Hong Kong fought back with violent protests and many fled to resist their encroaching authoritarian hand.
Did China raise more than a billion people out of brutal poverty in a single generation, and was it one of the most impressive and important developments of the last century? Yes, absolutely. Is an authoritarian technocracy better able to deal with the issues facing humanity in the near future like climate change? Potentially.
That doesn’t mean China’s citizens enjoy civil liberties.
Yes we do. The PRC is in the developing stage of socialism. The large firms and key industries are publicly owned, the medium firms are heavily controlled and planned, and as they grow they are further integrated into the planned nature of the economy. This is the general path to sublimating property and gradually collectivizing it. The US Empire, on the other hand, has private ownership of the large firms and key industries, and runs on imperialism, ie vast expropriation of wealth from the global south via financial and millitary domination.
I suggest reading Marxist-Leninist theory, if you want somewhere to start, I wrote an introductory reading list targetting those interested in theory but who don’t know where to start.
They said the PRC is as far from communism as the US is. Considering the PRC is a rising socialist country and the US is a dying capitalist empire, it follows that China is much further along in development.
Either way, the PRC is a state where the proletariat is in power. The authority of the state is used to suppress the bourgeoisie and resolve class conflicts in favor of the proletariat. The success of this is seen in high perceptions of democracy in China. The US, on the other hand, wields its authority in favor of the bourgeoisie, showing lower perceptions of democracy among the people.
The only way beyond the concept of “authoritarianism” is the abolition of the state, and that can only be accomplished by eliminating class, and that can only be accomplished via full collectivization of the economy on a global scale. We’re a long way off from there, so it’s best to have the proletariat in control until then.
The large firms and key industries are overwhelmingly publicly owned, public ownership is the principle aspect of the economy. Capitalism isn’t just “markets,” it’s when private ownership is the principle aspect of the economy. In the PRC, public ownership is principle.
The working class has recieved dramatic increases in real wages year over year consistently for decades. Development and planning of the economy puts the working class first, which is why their conditions habw improved dramatically. The CPC is not a bourgeois party.
The overwhelming majority of practicing Marxist-Leninist orgs support the PRC, and Marxism-Leninism is in turn by far the most significant branch of Marxism. Marxism is more broadly adopted than anarchism globally, the other major school of thought in the socialist movement.
Yes, like everywhere. Remember Tienanmen square protests?
No, because it happened before I was born. Do you not understand what a self own it is that you have to go back four decades for an example of Chinese police killing the amount of people that the US police kill every four months?
I don’t see why we have to contrast the US and China so that one is a good guy and one is a bad guy. Has the US exploited the rest of the world since WWII for our own financial interests? Yes. Do we have an increasingly authoritarian government seeking to eventually crush internal dissent? Yes.
None of that makes China good.
If you don’t want to talk about Tiananmen Square, talk about China forcefully relocated migrant workers ahead of the Olympics in 2008. Talk about China sending Uyghurs to reeducation camps and forcefully sterilizing some of them. Talk about how China forced women to abandon/ abort babies for 30 years throughout vast swaths of their country. Talk about how people residing in China can’t actually talk about any of these things, to the point where citizens of Hong Kong fought back with violent protests and many fled to resist their encroaching authoritarian hand.
Did China raise more than a billion people out of brutal poverty in a single generation, and was it one of the most impressive and important developments of the last century? Yes, absolutely. Is an authoritarian technocracy better able to deal with the issues facing humanity in the near future like climate change? Potentially.
That doesn’t mean China’s citizens enjoy civil liberties.
Yes, we do remember. What we don’t do is misremember. Previously.
We also remember the Kent State University protest.
A well debunked western propaganda? I remember the debunking ya!
Removed by mod
Most socialists/communists support the PRC, it isn’t particularly unusual.
Umm, no, they don’t. The PRC is about as far from communism as the US.
Yes we do. The PRC is in the developing stage of socialism. The large firms and key industries are publicly owned, the medium firms are heavily controlled and planned, and as they grow they are further integrated into the planned nature of the economy. This is the general path to sublimating property and gradually collectivizing it. The US Empire, on the other hand, has private ownership of the large firms and key industries, and runs on imperialism, ie vast expropriation of wealth from the global south via financial and millitary domination.
I suggest reading Marxist-Leninist theory, if you want somewhere to start, I wrote an introductory reading list targetting those interested in theory but who don’t know where to start.
We’re not talking about socialism. We’re talking about authoritarianism. Yes China is socialist-ish and also yes China is authoritarian
They said the PRC is as far from communism as the US is. Considering the PRC is a rising socialist country and the US is a dying capitalist empire, it follows that China is much further along in development.
Either way, the PRC is a state where the proletariat is in power. The authority of the state is used to suppress the bourgeoisie and resolve class conflicts in favor of the proletariat. The success of this is seen in high perceptions of democracy in China. The US, on the other hand, wields its authority in favor of the bourgeoisie, showing lower perceptions of democracy among the people.
The only way beyond the concept of “authoritarianism” is the abolition of the state, and that can only be accomplished by eliminating class, and that can only be accomplished via full collectivization of the economy on a global scale. We’re a long way off from there, so it’s best to have the proletariat in control until then.
You do realize there are communists other than you, right? Or is that the royal we?
I believe they mean themselves and pirateKaiser.
I don’t. China is VERY capitalist, it’s just that the people profiteering are almost only state officials.
This is wrong on both counts.
The large firms and key industries are overwhelmingly publicly owned, public ownership is the principle aspect of the economy. Capitalism isn’t just “markets,” it’s when private ownership is the principle aspect of the economy. In the PRC, public ownership is principle.
The working class has recieved dramatic increases in real wages year over year consistently for decades. Development and planning of the economy puts the working class first, which is why their conditions habw improved dramatically. The CPC is not a bourgeois party.
For further reading:
Qiao Collective’s Introductory Socialism with Chinese Characteristics Study Guide
Socialism with Chinese Characteristics ProleWiki page
Socialist Market Economy ProleWiki Page
People’s Republic of China ProleWiki Page
My “Read Theory, Darn It!” Introductory Marxist-Leninist Reading Guide
Has China Turned to Capitalism? Reflections on the Transition from Capitalism to Socialism by Domenico Losurdo
China Has Billionaires by Roderic Day
The Long Game and its Contradictions
Source: the PRC probably
The overwhelming majority of practicing Marxist-Leninist orgs support the PRC, and Marxism-Leninism is in turn by far the most significant branch of Marxism. Marxism is more broadly adopted than anarchism globally, the other major school of thought in the socialist movement.
The PRC does support the PRC, yes.
Liberals cannot comprehend anyone disagreeing with them